Tom Joyce on Tue, 4 Apr 2000 19:10:19 -0400 (EDT)


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Re: [PLUG] microsoft lost


Hi,
This is a response to my post. It is a bit off topic so I won't respond on here
after this so I don't post irrelevant information to the group. 

My main point in responding to the first post { Microsoft Loses} was to comment
on if the state would get sued because they ran Microsoft products: 

Written by someone else and responded to:

	>Remember our state is signing an agreement for M$ software??  I guess
	>the state is go to get sued also...  what do ya think??

	>>I think you don't know what you're talking about.  Why would PA get
	>>sued for something Microsoft did?

I was saying I think the State will get sued. Its not just because of choosing
Microsoft for their system but because of the other points I made. To answer
directly why PA may be sued for using Microsoft products is because they have
been proven to use their monoploy to influence dealings with business partners.
Who knows what they may have promised to get their system embedded into the
highest level of the PA Government. Maybe nothing but it makes people look
deeper into why the State chose to use them. This is my _opinion_ I may be
completely wrong.


	> > Here is my two cents. Do you want to drive your car in PA? Then you must use
	> > the new State License plates. {Unless you want to pay more for a specialty
	> > plate}
	> > I am in effect having to advertise for the State on my car a Government
	> > web site running software from a know monopoly. 

	> That's not entirely true.  Unlike Microsoft's software, you're not
	> required to upgrade your license plate to the latest model, not even
	> when you buy a new car.  I'm still using the same plate I got for my
	> first car 13 years ago.

This is true. The state is working on a 4 year project to phase out ALL old
plates some as old as 23 years old and replace them with the new ones with the
State address on them. It will also be illegal to use any frame that covers the
web address.
Read this at http://www.dot.state.pa.us but of course it is best to
use Microsoft Explorer to view those pages. It says so right on the web page,
{Could that be something that will be required on all government pages or was
that just their web designers opinion?}

	>>They are looking into providing ecommerce through the State site.
	>>Who will be allowed what will be banned.? Second Amendment rights, the
	>>software etc....The whole deal seems like it is going to cost us {PA
	>>residents} money somehow in a lawsuit to me too.  

	> What exactly does the Second Amendment (the right to keep and bear
	> arms) have to do with ecommerce?

This was a mistake on my part I was reffering to the first amendment. My
point here was that on a Government run site who makes the decisions of what
will be allowed? This may lead to a lawsuit for the State.


	> > If the plates were to be a specialty item I would probably buy one but forcing
	> > me to get one or pay more makes me annoyed. 
 
	> So you'd pay extra to get the new plates, but don't want to pay
	> regular price for them?

If the state offered a specialty plate to promote technology
I would consider buying it. But my complaint is I must advertise for them.
The web site will be on millions of cars crossing this state and coast to
coast. Then if they recommend Microsoft products to view and use the site
Microsoft scores BIG. Again another possible lawsuit.

	> > The whole State web site could be
	> > run on an open source platform like Linux but they {the State} chose to spend
	> > 100's of thousands on Microsoft crap.  This is our State and as far as I know
	> > our State didn't look into too many other options for web server systems, they
	> > saw Microsoft would give $100,000 and they jumped right in.  From a Linux
	> > standpoint, who has a $100,000 to throw in? I heard on the news tonight Bill
	> > Gates personally lost over 12 BILLION dollars today. This in my opinion is what
	> > the lawsuit is or was about and why it WILL cost PA money someday. They
	> > {Microsoft} are so big they use thier size to make deals others can't compete
	> > with. 
	> 
	> You sound like you're contradicting yourself here.  Did PA pay
	> $100,000 for the web site, or did Microsoft pay PA $100,000 to use
	> their tools to build the site?  If they did, in fact, offer to pay the
	> state a large sum of money to use their tools to build the site,
	> exactly how do you think the citizens of this state were harmed?
	> Hell, I think Microsoft is as evil as the next guy, but I pay enough
	> in taxes as it is.  If big, evil, monopolistic Microsoft wants to
	> build my state a web site for free, I don't have a big problem with
	> that.  Maybe we can talk Bell Atlantic into a deal for some free phone
	> service, too.
	
I don't have the exact amount PA paid for the web site. It is a very involved
site. Add in design, servers, bandwith and the cost can easily pass $100,000.
Microsoft is giving $100,000 in Consulting work on how to set up and run their
software on the newest ecommerce part of the site. The state is paying for
everything else.   

I feel that it may not be the citizens that are really hurt but the users of
other operating systems that are being squeezed out because of someone with
money and power. {Microsoft} If people don't say anything then Microsoft will
take over this State and there is no turning back. As for Taxes, and this
really off topic, we pay so much here from city taxes to tolls etc that it
unbelievable but I will not go into that.

	> As for Bill Gates losing
	>$12 billion today, I imagine that he must 
	>have long since gotten used to his
	>net worth going up or down by several billion a day.  
	>Despite today's big
	>selloff, their stock price 
	> is still 10% higher than it was a year ago, and Gates is still the 
	> richest man on the planet.  Why do you think that his losing a few 
	> billion today will cause PA to also lose money? 

His losing anything will not cause PA to lose money but the amount he lost was
meant as how much BIG money I was reffering too. This guy loses Billions on
fluctuations. His company is HUGE. This is what I meant. We are dealing with a 
huge monopolistic company that can lose HUGE amounts of money and still be a
player. What other computer company can compete with that?

In my opinion PA is on its list to conquer and when they do and the State goes
along, someday someone will say "Hey, what's going on here?" and file a lawsuit
that our State will have to fight costing the taxpayers more than any web site
would of cost.


Tom Joyce

 


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