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On Sat, 9 Jan 1999, Rebecca Ore wrote:
> RedHat's configure tool and then a search through /etc/ for newly
> changed files is an education in itself. When I first tried to sign on
> to netaxs about two years ago, I was a newbie who'd never owned a
> computer with a modem before. I would never put anyone through that,
> myself. My assumption with anyone asking for help in setting up ppp is
> that it's quite likely that they are (a) not programmers used to the
> opaque language of man pages; (b) rather nervous about annoying their
> ISP by screwing up the connection and looking like a hacker or
> something.
I think it is safe to say that we have all been in the position of
being a confused, neophyte. I did my first Linux install not long
after getting my first PC. If it had not been for the lengthy chats
I had with Chris McKeen at World One BBS (one of the first Bulletin
Board Systems in DelCo to run Linux) who patiently answered my
endless questions, I may have been denied that wonderful early
experience with Linux.
> I use scripts when it's approprite -- writing up an alias for a command
> line so I can hook it to a GUI :). There's an implicit agenda in some
> people's insistance of doing things first the hard way -- that the only
> people who "deserve to use Linux" or "deserve to be on-line" are active
> programmers. So, of course, I'm going to steer people through getting
> on line the first time in the least painful and most rewarding way
> possible. Once on-line, they can learn what they will.
I am not and have never been part of any group that embraces
exclusion. I am a very strong believer in equality. That said, I
would like to assert that each persons perception of what is difficult
or painful is completely subjective. People who have previous
experience mainly limited to a GUI interface will probably feel more
at ease with the a GUI configuration system. Then there are those who,
for one reason or other, are more comfortable with a text based interface.
It is not unusual for those among the latter to actually find the GUI
intimidating. Your words suggest that you assume all Linux novices to
be among the former. Rather than make assumptions about the questioner
I requested specific information about the question.
> For programmers to expect programming skills of everyone smacks of
> immaturity or the sort of ridiculousness that some artists display when
> they say that the only people who count in society are artists and
> everyone else should go away (yes, there are artists who are as arrogant
> as programmers, with better justification as the money on the
> top is much better and most artists are better gardeners and cooks than
> programmers and have better taste in clothes).
Hmmm... interesting insight. You should note that making generalized
statements about groups also smacks of immaturity... at best. There
may well be some truth in these words, however it is overshadowed by a
tone of hostility and prejudice. Words can be like swords. Be careful
how you wield them.
> Guy wanted to get on-line. It's a panicky time for a lot of people and
> attempting to teach a moderate level skill in the middle of a clueless
> attack is a peculiar kind of aggression that I take delight in
> countering. I've countered it when I've seen novice despammers have the
Now you're rewriting history. Please show me at what point I attempted
to teach him a "moderate skill level". The only person making any
attacks here is you.
> same attacks. I've learned how to manage it when programmers get bad
> ass about a non-programmer finding a bug (these days, I know when it's
> me and when it's the program and when it's a combination of the two, and
> I go on a post-in strike until the programmer listens to me). I've been
> through this on two different mailing lists -- and there's an XEmacs bug
> named for me that nobody else found before I did.
You certainly wear your rage on your shirt sleeve.. good. I like that.
As far as how programmers respond to bug reports; please realize that,
for all but the top crust, programming open source software is a
thankless job. These people work long and hard to give you something
that they hope you will find useful and expect near to nothing in return.
What they usually get is endless requests for added features or fixes.
People become impatient waiting for these things not giving thought to
the programmers needs. You tend to come across like Gang Busters in
your messages, so I don't find it at all surprising that you have been
meet with defensiveness. I won't suggest that you handle the next bad
ass programmer you run into any differently. What I will suggest is
that you try to use a little sensitivity. It won't kill you. Consider
the other person's feelings and how you might feel if you were in that
persons shoes.
Roger C. Scudder Jr.
Philadelphia, PA, US
rscudder@usa.net
I'd rather be running Linux!
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