George Zipperlen on 14 Sep 2016 11:49:52 -0700

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Re: [PLUG] Replacement mailing list idea

DIY all the way. 

Google stability?  1) Less and less of the old DejaNews seems available each time I search. End up going back to my own very incomplete saved archives. 
2). I dumped Chrome browser the day it upgraded itself and wiped out all my plugins, extensions and personalizations, with no path back. 

Different (can of worms) example:  SourceForge. 

George Zipperlen 
Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 14, 2016, at 2:21 PM, Rich Kulawiec <> wrote:
>> On Wed, Sep 14, 2016 at 01:53:33PM -0400, K.S. Bhaskar wrote:
>> I realize PLUG is for do-it-yourself-ers, but why not set up a Google Group
>> (or a Yahoo Group, or???). It's less work, we're not dependent on an
>> individual, and searching past discussions is easier.
> Because both are poorly run, because Yahoo's future as a corporation is
> highly questionable (as is Yahoo Groups: look at what they just did to
> Yahoo IM with less than two months' warning), because Google is famous
> for being completely unresponsive to requests for support or help,
> because Google Groups has a longstanding and serious spam problem,
> and because exporting your data from them isn't easy.  (Try getting a
> complete copy of your Yahoo Group in *any* format, let alone one that's
> an open standard like "mbox".  Or try getting any kind of useful response
> from mandatory RFC 2142 role addresses at Google.)
> As to search, you can use any search engine you want on any public
> mailing list archive, since all of them are indexed; or you can simply
> keep a local mirror and use the search of your choice (which is what I
> do: sometimes that's "grepmail", which is an overlooked but surprising
> powerful tool, and sometimes that's Solr).
> Also note that Mailman 3.X has some pretty good search capabilities of
> its own, so that's eventually coming down the road.  It's also moving
> in the direction of integration between mailing lists and Usenet newsgroups
> (already well-supported) and web-based discussion forums (newly there).
> A larger solution for this would be to have various LUGs federate and
> migrate their lists to a single operation, which would provide economies
> of scale and make it easier for smaller LUGs to have the same quality
> service as larger ones.  It'd have to be done carefully in order to
> avoid creating single-point-of-failure issues, but it really could be
> done without too much fuss because no individual LUG's lists have all
> that many members or all that much traffic.
> ---rsk

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